Regarding iCal Syncing
First, let me say that everyone who downloaded Actiontastic, posted comments, or emailed ideas rocks. Thank you for the inspiring cloud of smoke rising from my poor little server.
(If you’ve just stumbled upon this blog, you can read about the beta in the previous post.)
Somewhere around eleventy billion of you asked about iCal support, so here’s the deal — I would like to add iCal syncing to Actiontastic, but need your help. For those of you who do not require iCal syncing, it will be off by default and out of the way.
You see, my original plan did not include iCal syncing for version 1.0 because, frankly, I think iCal degrades the GTD experience. It does not understand contexts, and creating a separate calendar for each context just smells funny. Not to mention, it has no concept of projects. I really believe that syncing with the web and using a mobile device is the best possible solution, but would like to accommodate any of you non-webified-PDA fans if I can. (After years of PDA use, I have given up on them until someone makes a non-brick-like smartphone that respects the Mac.)
To set the stage, I will assume that the iCal sync is indeed for the purpose of being a PDA middle man. (Send email if I’m wrong here.) How would you like for this to behave? Does your PDA understand different calendars? For that matter, what PDA are you using? (While you’re at it, what phone are you using?) Here are some options that have crossed my mind, with their respective pros and cons. Feel free to add your own:
1) Sync only Next Actions
Pros: Having a managable list size on your PDA.
Cons: Getting out of sync after the first action is completed for a project.
2) Use “code” in the Actions a la “@email - Bob re meeting notes”
Pros: Sortable on the PDA, Adding new contexts is easy, Everything stays in sync, No multi-calendar smell.
Cons: Long lists to scroll through (read: tired Blackberry thumbs)
3) Sync everything, Contexts be damned
Pros: Shorter tasks names for small screen widths, Everything stays in sync.
Cons: Context information is removed, making this less GTDish.
Please post your ideas related to this in the comments section or email them to actiontastic-beta@kaboomerang.com. (Others who asked for non-iCal goodies will also be happy with upcoming features, but those details are for another post.)
Matt wrote:
Jon,
While iCal sync might be cool (witness Merlin`s post on living in iCal), I think your fans would be better able to answer this question after we hear more about how this online concept of yours is developing… At the risk of being slaughtered, I’ll add that you might consider the sage advice of the 37signals crew that says “give them what they need” and their general concepts of simplifying the user experience.
Posted on 02-Oct-06 at 10:38 am | Permalink
Andy Fragen wrote:
Jon,
In iCal tasks have a due date of sorts.
1. I think you can/should take the route of syncing to a single ‘Actiontastic’ calendar.
2. Another way to do it is to utilize the Projects list as individual calendars. It could get messy but certainly makes it more ‘in-sync’ with Actiontastic.
Personally I think #1 is simpler to implement. If something like this could be implemented with your option #2. I think that’s a great solution.
As an aside, though I use a Treo 650 I don’t typically use the net access.
Posted on 02-Oct-06 at 11:55 am | Permalink
Brab wrote:
I use a Palm T3, which is not web enabled. I do not find categories for contexts pretty nice, and using DateBk 5 with views let me easily choose which contexts are displayed, depending on where I am.
Posted on 02-Oct-06 at 12:06 pm | Permalink
Roger W wrote:
I’d go for Sync option #1. Let me explain why:
As I see it, there is no such things as The Perfect Solution. Things happen. Things change and there is no sync solution in the world that will keep all my gears in sync all the time. The net sync you talked about is a HUGE step in the right direction, but even then this will not be perfect since I can’t be online all the time.
But the other rule (always in sync beeing number one) is beeing able to survey the whole situation. I want to have all my stuff at the same place, so I can get my priorities right. I want to be able to weigh the NA’s with the new stuff that have comes up while beeing on the road. And since I want to focus on the next action not on all the stuff I’ve written down, I would take the fact that I don’t automatically get the next -next action on my PDA after finishing the first one… (hope I’m able to make myself understood - it would be much easier in swedish ;-)
So a version that synced all the next actions to iCal would be a good solution for me. Paired with the ability to log on-line and access the Actiontastic that way.
A third reason to go for iCal sync is the fact that you can use it irrespective of what PDA you use. At least as long as Apple continues to support phones/PDA’s and Smartphones (at the moment it does not seem to be the case with SonyEricssons new superphones P990 and M600).
Posted on 02-Oct-06 at 12:41 pm | Permalink
Steve wrote:
How about Command-1..3 for moving amongst Inbox, Projects and Contexts
Posted on 02-Oct-06 at 7:25 pm | Permalink
Dan wrote:
I’m a non pda guy so would simply love a way to sync between 2 macs via web.
Have you seen the new SonyEricsson M600 - cross between a standard candybar & their P-range - touchscreen/symbian etc
http://www.engadget.com/2006/02/06/sony-ericssons-m600-3g-tri-band-gsm-cellphone/
Posted on 03-Oct-06 at 8:41 am | Permalink
Oliver Nielsen wrote:
Personally I really like your idea of the sync via web. It makes a lot of sense.
Maybe stick with your guts and keep the iCal-stuff for the 1.1 or 1.5 or 2.0 update.
PS: The M600 smartphone indeed does look very neat, but it does not seem to sync via iSync;-(
Posted on 03-Oct-06 at 2:52 pm | Permalink
Joel wrote:
I use a Treo 650 and Tasks. I sync the Treo regularly with iCal (via The Missing Sync).
I have categories set-up in Tasks that syncs well with iCal… however, each category is interpreted as a new “calendar.” I don’t mind this at all because they’re color-coded, and because I just use the Unfiled category in iCal anyway
I’m a bit hesitant to make Actionstastic sync with iCal. I’m afraid it might limit how GTD works.
So for now, I’m using Actiontastic by itself… and I’ve always got things done :)
Posted on 03-Oct-06 at 3:41 pm | Permalink
Bob wrote:
After thinking about this carefully and reading your above post, I’ve done a uturn and decided I for one could do without iCal syncing.
If web-based todo list access were designed very carefully for PDA screens (the resolution of my 3G Treo 750 is 240×240), and it proved to be reliable, I think it would be a very effective way of keeping up to date and I would thoroughly support it over iCal syncing. Perhaps you should stick with your instincts and release iCal syncing once people have tried the web-based version and given you further feedback?
Unfortunately, 3G data costs in the UK are still pretty ridiculous, so many of your users may well end up paying a “GTD tax,” depending on how fiendishly addicted they get to the service. It might also not prove very effective to 2G or 2.5G users; GPRS-based web access is not known for its stability or speed.
I’d much rather have one really good and reliable way of accessing my GTD info on the move (web-based) rather than two options that were hurried out slightly rough-around-the-edges due to pressure from users who haven’t even tried the web-based option.
If you need any beta-testers for the web-service, do shout up.
Posted on 03-Oct-06 at 3:47 pm | Permalink
Jon wrote:
@Everyone:
Thanks for thinking out loud here with me on the blog. It is great to hear about how you personally see this working/not working and the emails on top of these comments are excellent.
Regarding beta-testers for the web-service, I’ll keep in touch via our beta email list if the beta starts out as private. Otherwise, it will be announced here on the blog.
Posted on 04-Oct-06 at 8:28 am | Permalink
Jesse D. Hollington wrote:
I’m on a Blackberry myself, synced through an Exchange server with Groupcal (the only real way to get stuff onto the Blackberry reliably and without having to mess with cabled connections).
My preference would be separate calendars in iCal for each context. In my case I’m already using that to some degree, since the colour coding is useful, and the contexts generally are in line with my appointments as well (ie, I use different calendars for calls, working at my desk, visiting clients, travelling, etc so that I can take advantage of the colour codes to view where I”m going to be “at-a-glance”).
I presently use kGTD and already file my various contexts against the various calendars. However, kGTD also allows for some mapping functionality, so there are places where two contexts go into a single iCal calendar. While this may not be *pure* GTD, there are many times when I’m on the go that certain contexts are naturally combined (errands and client visits, for instance).
So, to sum it all up, my vote for the ideal solution would be one of two options:
1. Sync all Actiontastic tasks to calendars that match contexts. Ideally, setting up Context-to-Calendar matching preferences would be great, but I could live with naming my contexts to match my iCal calendars as well.
2. Less preferable, but if we’re only going to sync to ONE calendar, then there should be a choice of WHICH contexts get synced. There are contexts that are completely irrelevant to my PDA, so I could live with those not being in iCal (for example, the context for @Desk doesn’t need to be on my PDA, since I have my computer at my desk anyway). At least in this case, the PDA actually *becomes* a context in a sense.
As for the syncing of next-action items only versus ALL items, I would imagine a configurable option wouldn’t be too difficult to implement for this once the basic syncing was put in place anyway. However, if we had to choose one or the other, I’d prefer syncing of ALL items, perhaps with “Next Actions” getting today’s date, and future actions getting some future datestamp, which would allow for some inherent filtering/sorting on most portable devices.
Ultimately, the biggest problem for me with a web-based solution is that having to access a web page from a PDA defeats the purpose of having a task list. I can go to my tasks app, review it, and check off a couple of things on my Blackberry in about 30 seconds or less, while I’m running between appointments. Accessing a web-page will take an additional 30-60 seconds just to get the browser up, get to the page, get logged in, and then wait for refresh times. Further, there are still too many places where web access isn’t available (for example, I’m usually doing most of my GTD review in the subway while I’m travelling between appointments).
Posted on 04-Oct-06 at 10:41 am | Permalink
Bob wrote:
One more thought — how would a web-based alarm system work for todos? Currently I’m able to set alarms for all todos on the Treo/in iCal. Would this be possible if todos were web-based?
Posted on 04-Oct-06 at 2:12 pm | Permalink
Alex wrote:
You’re right: I like to use iCal for tasks only because of Palm syncing (otherwise, just about anything would work, even text files, at least as well, and in some cases, better).
My solution was to create an iCal group called @To Do and then create a calendar for each context. This way, I can turn off as many context calendars as I want, and see only those contexts I want to work within.
This works very well right now using Missing Sync and iCal with the Palm, so such a setup might be the simplest for those of us who want to sync. Actiontastic could create a calendar for each context/sync with a context calendar…and ignore project categories, because iCal and projects don’t mix very well.
One other suggestion includes making a lite/less expensive or free version of Actiontastic that doesn’t sync for people who like pretty much what you have cooked up right now, and bake something with sync and some other more complicated goodies for the full version. Think about it!
Posted on 04-Oct-06 at 6:09 pm | Permalink
tomas wrote:
I completely agree with mr Hollington above, syncing contexts to iCal calendars is the way to go. That way, I can select in iCal which contexts I want to sync to my mobile phone. This would be great since my phone puts all todos in one long list, so I only want relevant todos in there.
Posted on 13-Oct-06 at 4:59 am | Permalink
robin barooah wrote:
Hi,
I’d vote for the ’syncing contexts to ical calendars’ approach.
Alternatively, I’d be happy if there was just one actiontastic calendar, and preferences to choose which contexts were synced to it.
I use heavily as a calendar - both at home and at work - and I sync both ways (via icalx.com) and with my Nokia N70 phone.
What I’d like to do with the GTD stuff from actiontastic is just to export an ‘out’ context - I don’t want my full action list with me - just the ones that are actionable when I’m out and about.
Posted on 17-Oct-06 at 9:28 pm | Permalink
Midnight Inbox, Ghost Action and Actiontastic « Bloody Fingers wrote:
[…] This is obvious when you try and compare Ghost Action and Actiontastic: these two (independent!) apps look like they’ve been separated at birth. Both feature three tabs on top to switch between contexts, actions and projects, a source list on the left, and a list of actions in the center. The user experience is basically the same with both apps. You create a few contexts and projects, enter a few actions, and then the app will suggest your next action. Very simple. On a purely cosmetic basis, Actiontastic (screenshot) looks somewhat more up-to-date: the metal window has no borders, there’s a filter widget that reminds of Spotlight… but Ghost Action (screenshot) has a few features of his own: it can sync the next actions with iCal, .mac and isync-enabled PDAs and phones, which is pretty important for this kind of app (this is apparently coming to Actiontastic, but it’s not there yet). Still, the choice is pretty difficult. Personally, I like Ghost Action, but I don’t have any convincing argument apart from that it “feels” better (also the source list elements are not aligned correctly in Actiontastic — I know, I am vain). […]
Posted on 04-Nov-06 at 6:44 am | Permalink
KaBlog / RELEASE: Actiontastic 0.9 wrote:
[…] Previously, we discussed a mismatch between iCal ToDos and hot GTD action on a stick. Actiontastic attempts to get around this mismatch by beating iCal with said stick. The pieces break down like this: […]
Posted on 15-Jan-07 at 3:35 am | Permalink
Renaud wrote:
Cast one more vote for Mr. Hollington’s approach!
The iCal / Sync services / MacOS integration is obviously the way to go.
Forget about web-based syncing and looking that up on a PDA browser (this is slow, usually costly, and BTW, syncing to which web service ? This is not standardized at all).
Come on, it’s kinda silly not to leverage your PDA’s built-in task list/calendaring/alerting functionality, the whole iCal protocol and the ready-made syncing infrastructure OS X provides.
BTW, iSync allows you to choose which iCal calendars to sync to a given PDA, which fits like a glove with the concept of contexts.
So I guess my ideal GTD software would do the following :
- Be as much open/standards compliant/iCal-iSync friendly as possible.
- Map contexts to iCal calendars.
- Sync n next actions per project to those calendars (n is a user setting, from 1 to “all”)
- Give next action higher priority than other tasks. Most PDAs/phones understand priorities and give a way to sort tasks by priority. This makes things more manageable on a single calendar phone/PDA.
- Flawless 2-way syncing with iCal: I find it crucial to be able to quickly write down a thought on the PDA/phone while on the road, or be able to collect in iCal if I prefer, and the app should just happily import it to the Inbox.
The last point may seem obvious, but I’m about to drop kGTD for that reason alone : it is stubborn on deleting whatever tasks I enter in iCal/phone instead of importing them. :(
Posted on 20-Feb-07 at 6:19 pm | Permalink